A yearly convention takes place in Vermont.  Conferences take place in different regions around the country.  Chapters have meetings most months of the year.  The ASD bookstore has a large supply of dowsing tools, books, videos and other dowsing related items.  Water For Humanity, a charitable project associated with the ASD, helps find water and dig wells in areas that need it.  Contact the ASD to find out who to contact about activities in your area and what the ASD can do for you.

Note: This has been transcribed from an audio tape. Occasionally voices and/or words were unclear. As a result speakers may not always be correctly identified There has been minor editing. ?=unknown speaker; (sp?) unsure of spelling of a name; [?? unintelligible] pb

Moderator: Robert Gandrup

Robert Gandrup:

I would like to thank all the people responsible for making this conference what it is. It was magic, brilliant. We've been appreciating [??] there's company and everything. It's been that way for me. I hope it's been that way for everyone else.

What we want to do tonight, is basically have an open forum, where ideas are exchanged between the general membership and those in power. (laughter)

Barry Smith - President :
We have to destroy that reality in [??] right now (laughter)

RG:
We have a microphone down here, so If anyone wants to bring up an issue or something, please come down and use it, that way it will go on tape. That way this tape will be able to used later and be used as evidence  ...(laughter)
Just a couple of ideas or subjects we might want to talk about.

What are the definitions of dowsers,

What are the definitions of ASD,

What is the Mission statement for ASD

What does it mean to people

What is the direction the ASD is going to take in the future

What are the plans ASD may have to accomplish the ends to support that mission statement.

Where are the members. There are a lot of members here, I understand, who are members of ASD that don't come to meetings. They may come to a conference once in a while. What keeps them still in the ASD. What attracted them in the first place. How can we use that information to attract new membership. And what are future activities?

Alright, who wants to be first? Start on the topics.

? Just answer the questions you put before us

Alex Champion:
I'd like to hear from the President, where he sees ASD doing in the next two years.

Shirley Runco:
I have so much to say I will have to stand by the microphone (laughter)
Recently I was asked to give a talk about dowsing to a group of people in San Jose. I looked for a definition of dowsing and I went through my books. The best definition I found for my talk was in(side) the front page of the Quarterly. It comes out quarterly. I don't have it in front of me, but if you are asking for the purpose and the goal and the whole reason we exist, its right there and it really does say it all. I'll be back (laughter).

? Unfortunately we don't have anybody taking notes. Make sure you state your name into the mike.

AC:
I just want to give my definition of dowsing. It is very simple. To be actively intuitive.

John Van Drie:
My definition of dowsing is: Using Tools to get information from the universe, that is not available by the five senses.

Frank Jordan:
I see dowsing as applied intuition. Even had the thought of the American Society of Applied Intuition or something like that.

RG:
There all good definitions. I guess we need to figure out how is how that really applies to the ASD and how we can use that in the public eye. Any input on that?>

? You need to ask what are the goals, if you are going to ask that.

RG: Part of the Mission statement is also defining goals. The mission statement basically is what it is, and the goals support that mission statement.
Anyone have any input in what they feel a good Mission Statement is for ASD? Is there a real, honest to goodness definition for a Mission statement for ASD?

? Anybody have a copy of a Quarterly. Has anybody read it? It's in there.

RG:
I think that it states to forward the understanding and study of dowsing. ...... To put it forward as a genuine study and to defend it against. ... To show that it should be regarded as a genuine practice in the eye of science, rather than say it is science. It is much better stated than that. I think that is the stated mission of the Society. It's like a conference like this, you make a theme and there are 10,000 people running in different directions with it - that's what it's for.

Any other topic someone would like to go over? I just threw some ideas out. I know that there are a lot of questions out there and people have opinions, and this is the best place to bring them out.

Bruiena Skudenis (sp):
What's happening at the Board level, and may be the discussions at the national Board level, where there is conflict or controversy, and where our input may make a difference in one way or the other.

BS:
[?What is your name and your capacity] Minimal (laughter). I am Barry Smith, President of ASD, here to protect you.... from me... (laughter). Terry Ross said, the answer is asking the right question. I think organizationally, though, the answer is answering the right question. I have been asking the right question, but no answers for years. In fact, one Trustee that has been on the board for many years, and just left the Board, was so concerned, that Trustee put out a statement to every Trustee- We need a five year plan. I wrote back 'think that's great. Do you have any ideas, any points we might consider for it. The person came back with nothing. It's hard. It's hard. I am looking at it... we have to do the right things, the right way, the right time and the right people. And I add something else to that.. TANSTAAFL - a marketing concept - there ain't no such thing as a free lunch. If we don't do it, who's going to do it? If we don't do it now, when? And that's what we are having to deal with. And operations and how we operate and how we're going to do. So doing the right things is hard enough. You need that master plan and that purpose, that scope and so on, and that philosophy to do it. That's what we are starting on today. You're starting it. That's leadership - asking the right questions. Answering them the right way is management. That's easier, and harder. But next is timing, in the process, so your building on the strength and the balance of the national organization. Finally, the right people. I am in the same boat as many other Trustees, and we were almost taken back, as we are so used to 'well the Trustees have to do it', and the Trustees burn out or get frustrated, and there is turnover. So we are now looking to work more interactively with the membership. Nicholas really hit a lot of it. 'We are here now to broaden the membership and public understanding and support.

I just keep thinking of Mike Doney, Mike Royer and people like this - the unique things they are doing that we need to capitalize on. Formalize and encourage people , to help them jump over to be able to bridge into doing these things. Any questions?

? What is your goal, your game plan.

BS:
Actually I have just given you the game plan, as far as structure. And one thing I was saying there, was people. We've got to have more of the members involved. This is why I have gone out to the people that are active and want to be active, that want to develop policy. We don't have a lot of good policies. We have six regional VP's. But there isn't something well developed in policy. What we are looking at, and I have been in discussion with the Board, is everything ought to go through that regional VP. Of, course there are always safeguards. Were talking about getting districts started, where 3 chapters come together to form a district. Well you might be able to do all kinds of things, like putting on workshops, and organize it. After three chapters get together to form a district, first of all, it's going to get people's attention, cause it hasn't been done. Accept originally, one was done when they originally put that into the By-laws. You come forth to the Board of Trustees, and you are an organized district, your going to get their attention, big time. You can get together and work on speakers and a balanced programing. Your own balance. Any of you who have been president of the chapter, you know at the back of your mind, 'I've got to be watching out that it doesn't become me - my interest interests I assume are everybody else's interests'. So you keep that balanced program. So I've talked with Rod Berger, who is in the northeast, about New York - for example there is a man who goes to four chapter meetings. Now, he is interested in working with Rob. Rob says, I've got three up there in Maine, you know with Gordon Barton etc. We can get something there. And we've tried down there [Southern California] with Sue and Inez and Al Denny. All tries to get car pooling, and plan some beach time if you are going out there. They want to do things in the newsletters. They are publicizing each other. Al has eight pages now I think. They have an internet site. That's another thing, internet sites have been flourishing.

Well, chapters. Al is a good example. He says, 'well, I have 160 members in my chapter, but they are dues paying members to the chapter, not ASD'. And, now, because there wasn't a good strong policy and a program to give him, gave him what I had at the time. Now we have to go back, and overcome that. That's' just one example.

So we start having the policies that can work for the chapters, and we've got to have variations. There's not just one method that's going to work. You have to work with these people - it's a two way street. But, some of them say, 'well what are you doing for us'? Well, it's a two way street here. I think there's things we can give support to the chapter, while they are supporting, trying to get more members. And I have talked to a number of you in different ways.

Now, let's dream on a bit. I'd love to see a lot going more on the internet eventually. Barry Langer up there. He is trying to get the History [committee] going. People have wonderful things they want to donate. but they are not going to do it unless they know it is going to be safe guarded and it's going to be used. And how are you going to use it? Well, we can have different displays and themes. And there will be people teaching how they used to do something. Barry is dreaming. He says 'I want to have displays going all over the country', you know, rotating around.

Barry Langer: - Treasurer
Museum and library!

BS:
And a lot of tools. I am starting to get a lot of equipment donated, that we can use in different ways. There's where Barry L. is dreaming on a national basis. How about forums for different specialties. A forum for treasure hunting. A forum for Feng Shui and dowsing. A forum for Betty Epstein. (laughter). As she is coming down [to the mike], let me mention, that we have a hypnotherapy association that has the Queen Mary in Los Angeles. We have been negotiating with them. They are planning to have three noted dowsers, in fact one of them is here at this conference, who is going to be asked to be a speaker there, all on dowsing. That's where there is going to be a forum on dowsing and hypnotherapy.

Betty Epstein:
I do that all the time. I have a hypnotherapy school - a 350 hour course, a big part of that is teaching esoteric stuff, and dowsing is one of the subjects covered. And because of that, I have a lot of dowsers, who wouldn't be there otherwise. I have a group in Denton TX, who have applied for a chapter. They are a group who learned to dowse at our school, and recently they started sending out flyers to everyone who has been in our school, offering them certification as a hypnotherapist, the first levels $35, the next level - I forgot the amount. Well, It's like you keep coming back through the levels and you get to be a certified dowser. Well, what the hell is a certified dowser? We don't guarantee dowsing. You can't guarantee your work. What kind of test are you going to give? What kind of organization is going to back you. It's bullshit. I mean... it's not good. I don't know if they've been approved. Has anyone been approved from Denton TX? I think it's bogus. I've had people in the last three weeks, call me and want to know if I will give them the next level of certification. I said 'are you nuts' That's how I feel about it. I know there are movements across the country, for other groups to give certification as a dowser. And I think it's totally bogus.

SR:
I have just been going through the American Dowser. I have just gone through the Policies and Procedures and I have gone through the By-Laws and there is no mission statement. So maybe we need one.

RG: Every business in the corporate world has a mission statement

? We are not a business
? Yes we are

RG:
Any organization should have one.

SR:
Maybe that should be a goal of the new Board to get a mission statement for this organization.

SR
I was just talking with Frank, about the committee we are on, the Marketing Committee. What makes a successful chapter? Well, besides good speakers, you need to have many workshops after the presentation, so that people coming to the meeting for the first time have an opportunity to learn how to dowser. Basis school. Minimum hour, hour and a half. There needs to be something for advanced dowsers. Troubleshooting. There perhaps needs to be someone who can help them with self healing. Joe Whipich (sp?) came up to me and said he would be willing to offer an Advanced Dowsing school after our meeting. These are possibilities for enhancing your membership in your chapters. Not all chapters have these opportunities or have the teachers. The opportunity is there. What are other ways of increasing membership in local chapters.

RG.
Maybe a few people could tell us what brought them into chapters.

SR:
What's a good reason to pay $35 to join ASD? How many people know that by joining ASD they are covered by an insurance policy every time they have an event sponsored by ASD. How many chapters are aware of this. How many groups that form open forums...

RG:
I wouldn't advertise that.

Penelope Bell - Trustee, Next Generation Dowsers, WA
That shouldn't be the main reason for joining.

JC:
What is the main reason for joining.

? Camaraderie

Gladys McCoy:
I joined ASD, not only because my husband was in it, but because I love these people, and the more you are around these people, you have to be a part of them. And by being a member of ASD, you become part of one of the greatest families in the world. (Clapping)

BL:
I have been involved with the Danville [VT] chapter for six years. In the three years I was president, what we did was make a point to make a little press release in the local newspaper for each of our speakers. We averaged 10-15 guests per meeting. We also averaged a couple of new members per meeting. We have had some walk up to someone they don't know and say how do I join, even before the business meeting.

Joan Champion:
There is a Preamble and a Purpose [Paragraph one of Preamble] "Dowsing is a faculty employed with intent to expand the perceptive abilities of its practitioner beyond three-dimensional limitations. It is a most ancient, varied craft, as ancient and varied as humanity itself. It has roots, often shadowy, among all manner of peoples, lands and epochs. There seems to exist an ageless natural knowledge which enables us to identify ourselves with an unknown source of being and becoming; it is of primary significance, joining Earth, sea and stars". [Last paragraph of Preamble] "Any activity that investigates, perpetuates and expands humankind's lore, mysteries and beliefs, traditions and useful abilities should command at once loyalty and service. In the energizing of such activity, the power generated in and by a group of interested persons is greater by far than the mathematical sum of its members - one plus one is more than two". including... This is an introduction to what we do.

There is a Purpose here that says: [a ]"The purpose of the Society shall be to promote and foster communication and fellowship among all persons in anyway interested in dowsing...[its many branches and phases, for the enjoyable social sharing of the common interest]". [It really doesn't go into what dowsing is] [b] to build in America an effective, authoritative, responsible body of men and women devoted to active investigation, study and application of dowsing. [c] to advance dowsing knowledge....., [d] to encourage the application of methods..., [e] to offer evidence of dowsing's realm of usefulness to man, [f] to give all possible assistance and encouragement to the quickening and development of the dowsing faculty...."But It doesn't define dowsing in any way. It goes on. This is in the By-laws.

?What about By-laws?

? By request, they are available to the public.

PB
Part of my focus in choosing to run for Trustee was to work with what ever committee it is, to make sure we get as much of this information as possible, on line. Certainly it is available if you request it from the ASD office, but to get as much of this information on line as soon as possible so it's available for anybody who wants to look at it.

Slightly changing the topic. Barry (S) and I talked the last couple of days, and he mentioned it earlier, of a time line for where we are going with this, and agreed to head up the group that decides to work on the time line. If you have anything that is important, what ever a committee is going to do, to have input into the time line, so we can look at it as a whole and then start juggling as we need to. There may be some overlap and that is a good idea, but there may be some overlaps that aren't good, so we need to see how to move things around. So, for the time line, were looking at a two year time line, so get in touch with me, or get in touch with Barry (S), I'll give you my email get my business card, get in touch with ASD. I'm going to be the focus computer for that time line. I it will be there, it will reside there, it will be manipulated there, depending on the input from everybody else and the trustees. My email address is bellasoc@isomedia.com .

BS:
That is part of the whole operations, how we are operating as a Board, using Robert's Rules of Order. A new experience for some of us. This time line is events. These events can be a calendar and it could also be by function. You might look up the election process and see how the publication process is going, etc. It would be nice to eventually have this on the web.

Penn is willing to work both on that. Something that we'll go into, I hope. That is a an expanded, tabbed note book for Trustees, giving them all the information they need. Giving them the state laws that are appropriate, and the corporate charter. It's extensive what we are talking about, but extremely valuable.

Another thing when I started talking about districts and what it could lead to in speakers, that Frank Jordan has been working on, is the Marketing department. We can also have provosts, this is in our By-Laws. In working with the Regional Vice Presidents, we can look for certain territories. Example: the one for the VP - Karen Ashley for the West Coast, she might feel it is important, and working with Penn and Ross in Seattle, maybe there is someone as a provost, working with chapters in the state of Washington, for example.

? What is a provost?

BS:
A provost is someone who is appointed by the President, with the Board approval, to represent the territory or area. I referenced it automatically because it would be within a region. I would not appointment someone with out that Regional Vice-President approving it, and it would probably come from the Regional VP. I want to have that strength, that these Regionals are where we have real leadership developing. And at the same time we have some real development and support of the chapters. There can be as many provosts as we need - as appropriate as we go along. I have created one, that is going to be appointed here. That is Headquarters provost, for the Headquarters and Bookstore, to give us a strong environment of 'no politics' at the national office. (clapping)

I have someone who is very reserved and reluctant. I had to write a complete breakdown of this, and he has finally accepted. Ray Maitchell (sp?). He is also the one in there all the time, he has networked our computer systems. He is working with our webmaster. He is building the computers for us, doing some phenomenal things. He has only one objective - No Politics. You be objective, in the spirit and intent of ASD, and that's what Joe was talking about.

Any other comments? Oh, Ralph wants to speak, and Joe, our Regional VP for the mid-west, and he is experienced. Ralph is one of the most important positions as the chapter liaison to the Marketing Committee, so he is national's chapter support. He is taking it seriously. I found out that he took 70 percent of the people coming to his meetings, and got them instantly to join ASD.

? How did you do that?

Ralph Squire:
I think we need an increase in benefits. I agree with what Gladys said. I come to a conference and feel like I am in a family reunion. But there are a lot of members out there. All their getting for their $35, is the Digest and the Newsletter, and they don't see it's worth it. The Trustees are already working on that. To increase the reader friendliness of the Digest. We have a Publications Committee, and hope your are going to see some changes there.

We need a new image of ASD, of real dignity. One thing that I did at my local chapter level, was to increase benefits for the ASD members. That is, those that belong to ASD and the local chapter, over those that just happen to be drift in and out. I did three things. First, I have two different types of meetings now. One I have an outside speaker, and I really publicize that to try to get new people in, and I call it a seminar sponsored by the Mother Lode Chapter. I want a lot of people there who are not members. We promote and I go around and introduce everybody, I ask that they state their name and where they are from, and tell whether you're a member or not, and there's are a few people who sheepishly say, 'no, I'm just a guest' .
I have another type of meeting, in the home of Dena and I, in which only ASD members can attend, open forum, we can talk about anything we want. Sometimes pretty wild and can get a little bit deeper into subjects that a speaker is not going to cover. And the other thing, I created an email list for ASD members of the chapter. And in addition to the notices, that they get much earlier than the mail later. Plus I sent other little blurbs occasionally. I include other chapter chairmen - complementary. Things I get out of newsletters, a bit of wisdom, to that list. I let everybody else that is not a member know that, boy are you guys missing out. OK, now what I want to do at the national level, what I volunteered for with Barry S, is to help other chapters with some of these ideas. How to form new branch chapters to start off. How to form a district. How to have some new concepts on how to conduct chapter meetings. There's lots of ideas. I want to take the ideas that everybody else found successful, and spread that word far and wide. And build that email list for all chapter leaders. You all got a copy of the program list for the speakers at this conference - at the back you'll find Ralph Squire and the email, mail etc. you'll find it right there. (clapping)

Joe Smith:
I was Trustee for four years and we had some awful stormy times. We may wish that all the Trustees do their best to get along. (Clapping)

PB:
I want to follow on, on what Ralph said. I am an officer with a new (and the second) chapter in the state of Washington, and I am hearing rumors of a third one in the works. We've taken some good points of a number of other chapters. When we decided to be a chapter, we went out to fifteen other chapters that we understood were very successful chapters. We asked what they were doing that was successful and what mistakes they had made, and we are also following on something Ross Dedrickson in the Puget Sound Chapter, in the past from what I heard, is gathering in peoples homes. I want to thank Ross for that idea. We are a statewide focus chapter, and our intent is, and we advertise this, if somebody wants to have a group of dowsers, we'll come to you. We'll go on the road for a meeting. We'll help you organize, if that's what you want. (Clapping)
 

Taffy Lancer - Phoenix chapter
Haven't been attending meetings lately as they have changed to Sundays, and that's not good for me. But, we have quite a large group of people who attend meetings, they are dealt with quite successfully, but I am feeling that the President of the Phoenix chapter were here, and the heads of other chapters, because the information coming out of this forum is very interesting, and can be used to help the other chapters and their membership in ASD. I am hoping that the information from this can be gotten to other chapters that are not being represented here.

Dennis Swayda:
We are definitely being recorded here.

Pohara Hart:
I'm new to this, so I am coming here very humbly, I appreciate these incredible people who are doing this dowsing for decades and decades. I am also noticing that there are not a lot of people in their 20', 30', and 40's generations here. I am somewhat concerned. People get tired, they want to do something else, who is going to pick this up. The other thing I have noticed, and I notice it almost everywhere I go to play in metaphysical circles, we are mostly white and there are a lot of other people who we might want to bring in and get perspective from different cultural viewpoints. Because I know when I play with the Native Americans they have a lot to teach me. When I play with the African Americans, they have a lot to teach me. So, I don't know how to do this, but I will be thinking about what golden opportunities to increase our membership in that direction or any direction. So if you have suggestions for me I would appreciate it. (Clapping)

RG: Anything else to add or questions to ask.

Brian Dusbury - President Tucson chapter.
To follow Ralph earlier on. What do people get for their contribution? I appreciate what you said Gladys, that this is a family, and not everybody comes to the conferences. A lot of people are struggling out there in the chapters. There two people here from our chapter and that's all. We've got 200 people on our emailing list. We've got 75 to 80 ASD members, of which only 25 turn up for meetings. Why? They are preoccupied with other things. They've learnt dowsing, and then used it to acquire a profession and use it in their profession, so they've gone. And as far as were concerned, I must be one of the youngest in our chapter. They're all in their 80's and we have a huge gap, and we cannot get to the youngsters. One of the things that's come out of the conversation with Homer (?) Is that we have to get to the children and start training the children now, and we've got to get to university students. We've got 30,000 people at the University. If we find 10-20 people out of there...What we don't have are actual practical dowsers, because they have either died on us, or left. What we've got are a lot of people who turn up for entertainment. And so, the real problem is - we don't want to have dull meetings, otherwise nobody will turn up. On the other hand, if you just have entertainment, people will not come to the first part of the meeting, because that's about business and dowsing, then they'll come to listen to the speaker then disappear. They won't even stay for the pot luck. So, it is going to be an interesting challenge this year. And I don't know how ASD can help us, and I am sure we are not the only chapter that has this sort of problem. With due respect, who are ASD? We had to ask that question because we never saw a representative that came to us representing ASD, during the course of 5-6 years I've been... Well, Walt comes down. I think this is most important that ASD has to be visible.

PB:
We're talking about increasing membership. I am curious about why we want to increase membership. Is it because we want to feed more money into ASD and therefore get more programs going, or is it for training people to be dowsers in their own lives. If I have a reason to go to a meeting because I want to learn - I am one of those information sponge people - and I want to learn how to do something and add to my life - that's going to be much more of a draw to me than just to join ASD to get a, may be interesting to me, Quarterly booklet. Maybe we need to enhance our focus beyond saying 'we want members'. Why is it beneficial to me, as a teenager, to get curious about ASD? How can I use it in my life. What is going to be the sexy thing to a teenager, that says I can use it in my life somehow.

BE:
When we do a conference in Dallas, we give the school and all the speakers free to anyone under 21. This doesn't cost us anything. Why doesn't everyone give that free to kids? And we get a big response. Carl Boyd (?) drives out there and puts on a wonderful kids school for us. I am sure he would be delighted to do it in a small scale, anybody would, who likes kids and wants to see this passed down to the younger generations.

I want to address the ethnic problem. When we are having a meeting, I put a notice up in the only black bookstore in Dallas. We have probably a third of our regular members are black or brown. And they contribute a great deal. One of our members is Native American shaman and he brings a lot of Native American people in. It's a matter of going out an looking for them. They are not going to look for you. So, you go seek them out and let them know they are welcome, that we're delighted to have them there, make them full members. We have a very active younger program because of Cassie and her friends. They come because they can use dowsing for fun stuff. They can use it for finding things, like on the beach today or where ever they go. I advertise to all the non-religious private schools, that I am available to teach. Last month I had a teacher from a Montessori school brought 72 kids to my school. They came because Alex Champion's labyrinth. They are very into labyrinths, and heard that I have an earthworks labyrinth at my office. She brought all these kids down to walk the labyrinth, and as it turns out, when they found out there is dowsing available, I ended up spending the whole day, in the garden, teaching the kids to dowse, and they walked the labyrinth and checked all their stuff after they did the labyrinth. It was awesome. But it's a matter of seeking them out. You need to be proactive. You cannot be reactive to your life or to any part. If your not out there looking for players, you won't have anybody to play with. (clapping)

Don Harmon:
When David Schultz was here, he was teaching classes in at least three junior colleges on an ongoing basis. This is something we might look into. This is an age group that might be more receptive. Children we are dealing with, but I see very few collage age people, Unless it's a family group and the adults have brought the younger people. I don't know if it's there or not, but some kind of a teaching program, possibly from David or somebody else - that can be used by somebody else to go in and teach. Shirley (Runco) teaches classes and other people teach classes. If you had a program that was laid that other people could handle in other locations. It would be able to generate interest for them and other people around them. One goes to two, two goes to four and four goes to eight etc.

Mardi Geissler:
On attracting other diverse groups, I want to remind you that 'Letter To Robin' is in four different languages, available for download on the internet, at www.lettertorobin.org. The second thing I learned in business, you can't get people to buy something if they don't know about it, if they don't see it. So you have to get your product out there. You need to advertise ASD. People need to be aware that there is a dowsers organization, and if they know about it, there is going to be a percentage that are going to be interested in it. I have had real trouble trying to get things advertised in the regular newspapers and I think the only way is to pay for advertising [? Metaphysical] newspapers usually use that.

The problem in Tucson, is that we had 5 metaphysical bookstores and one metaphysical newspaper and they are all defunct now. There is no place in southern Arizona to advertise, so you have the regular newspapers and they are not very receptive to dowsing. So think of regular paid advertising.

SR:
For a couple of years [I did] fairs, festivals and expos and set up a table with information. The majority of the people who came up looking, what's dowsing all about, and you tell them water witching. Oh, yeah, my grandfather .... Well I didn't know you had a formal society. So you explain to them, you give them handouts, tell them about chapters. So obviously, there's a large segment of society that knows about water witches, because they have read it in their history books, but don't know who we are and that we are available. So, maybe some of the chapters, if you have local expos or country fairs or events that the public comes to, you can make the effort to be there. I'd be more than happy to give you the information I share with other people, to just introduce them to the fact we are not, crazy necessarily. [? we may be crazy, but at least we have fun] In other words go out into the community. Go to the school fairs, there's lots of public events that we can do this with, and interest people. People are interested. They are very, very interested if they know it exists.

FJ:
For the past year and a half I have been working with the Promotion and Development Committee to answer the questions you have come up with. How do we do this. My determination in working with organizations that are successful, they all have a marketing chairman. Someone whose paid job it is to go out and make sure all of these things happen. A marketing director job is to stimulate membership, increase the image of dowsing, inform the public, determine and implement marketing strategies and to distribute information produced by the organization. There is a need for a marketing director. We have been operating in a deficit mode, eroding the assets of the Society. Membership continues its decline at a rate of 200 or more a year to the current estimate level of 4000 members. Responses to the Board [of Trustees] approved questionnaire we put out last fall, indicate the need for greater participation by ASD, distributing meaningful information on a range of topics, a speakers bureau to draw from and improved publications back to the chapters. Our chapters need support and guidance to stimulate, hold and expand membership. A Marketing Director could do all of this. The average age of our membership is 58 for women, and 63 for men. Members voiced a strong support for changes that will positively strengthen our society, enhance or change our image with people and offer diversification to all organizations and associations. A Marketing Director's responsibility would be to instigate such a policy, a position in the national organization. #1 he could manage all external activities, that would free the Operations Manager to concentrate on internal management. These are just suggestions, folks, we are asking for suggestions from you also - how we could go about bringing this into a coordinated program. The big complaint I hear from the ladies back there [Vermont] is they don't have time to do their bookkeeping job and the job they are really hired to do, cause they are answering the phone, stimulating membership and answering questions, when that should be someone else's job. We need to develop and manage a strong web page to attract members and supply information. We need to build and manage a speakers bureau and determine the criteria for selecting qualified speakers. You could call up Headquarters and say 'I need a speaker on this subject, at this place at this time. And ASD would supply that, give you people you could call and be put in contact with.

We have an incredible cadre of people who are willing to travel and do speaking. In the questionnaire, 50% of the people indicated they would act in teaching positions.

#2 Direct marketing channels for people, products and information. That's really all ASD has to offer. People, speakers, teachers, products which ASD can sell for the speakers or other products like the bookstore, and information. We have an incredible abundance of information that is not getting out there. There is no source, no real channel, other than the bookstore for getting information out. We need to develop, I think, a bi-monthly magazine with advertising, so we could keep a good supply of information coming out, that could be self supporting with some advertising. Advertising could directly help to empower our speaker with products and things of that nature. In turn ASD could sell in there, through their bookstore, or where ever. It becomes a cycle, a mutual support system.

We need to develop and attract an education program for younger members. Develop outreach links to other organizations. I kinda got a chill in my spine, when I heard that ASD would not link their website to any other organization or sites. I think we are severely limiting the possibility we have by doing that. Yes, we need to select what sites we want to link to, but it is a good opportunity to get more people out there. I forget the number, Barry, we had something like 20,000 hits a week on our website. [BL - in a week it has varied from 19,000- 50,000] That's how many people are coming to our site looking for information, and we're not giving it to them. There not getting what they are asking for or they would be members, right?

We need to develop a Procedure Manual for holding conferences. John Van Drie is working on that. If Boise ID, wants to have a conference, we have a program set up where we can apply what has already been learned by people who are doing such fantastic work out here.

We need to assist the chapters in programs that will sustain membership. Not only get members in but to keep interest up, and that means a broader base of information.

The Marketing Director will participate in conferences, and I am talking about a professional person, that knows how to market people, products and information. Open channels to international dowsing to attract foreign members, and exchange programs, exactly like Penn Bell is talking about having a joint conference with the Canadians. Wouldn't that be neat?

Now we have a whole list of ways and means of making this happen. What we need from you people, support in not only your agreement that this is what potentially should be done, but more ideas and we need your hands involved. Hands on! This is where the [Regional] VP's are going to be instrumental. Ralph Squire is reaching out to develop marketing systems, ways of making things happen out here. I invite any/all of you to call me anytime with any ideas, or to work with Ralph, he has already invited you to do that, to help get these things, and these programs implemented and operating. We're not altogether asleep back there at headquarters. We're just trying to get established who we are and where we need to go. And how fast we can get there. (Clapping)

RS:
If your are going to market, your selling. If your selling life insurance, you have two basic ways you can get your client to sign on the dotted line. #1 you can wrestle them to the floor and put your knee on their chest and don't let em up til they sign. That doesn't work too good. Or [#2] you can convince the person, you are doing them a favor. They need this life insurance and they are going to thank you for explaining to them why they needed it. So I think we need to explain to people out there, why they need dowsing. There is one of the sessions at this conference, on how to find a job, something for everyday life for someone who is looking for a job. If we're going to reach young people, say college age, how to choose a mate. That might catch a mate. That might get their attention, how to pick a career. So let's get people where in their everyday life. We all agree that you can use dowsing for everything.

Ed Stillman, President Verde Valley chapter in Arizona, and ASD Education Advisor:
Only a very few of you are aware of our basic dowsing school at this conference. There were 11 teachers for the whole day. There is a certain amount of preparation for that. The tools have to be bought and provided to the students. We had 63 students. And those 63 students were all younger people. I've done this basic school now for 13 years and this group asked more good questions, didn't they? They challenged MaryMarie and I to answer these questions for them. New this time was the youth program, the kids, were in with us for the morning. One of them whispered in my ear - and it wasn't my grandson... 'You know, your program this morning was better than what we had in the afternoon.

Anyhow, it is a lot of work to put on a one day school. You have hand outs, we have a lesson plan we follow and we bring the students back in the afternoon and MaryMarie talks about how to ask the right question. And then we get into the questions, so we actually ended at 4:30. This is to give you an indication about what goes on in the basic school at this conference.

In our chapter we have 750 on our mailing list. We have 350 on email. We only have to mail 350. Sedona is a town of 11,000. The people at the hotels said if you really want a really good meeting to go to, there's the dowsers. We advertise in the local paper. We don't pay. They have a 'club' section. So the 'bolo tie group'- men who wear bolo ties, they meet, and the dowsers get theirs and we generally get a few column inches, and they generally put in pretty much what we write. We make it succinct. That comes in before the meeting, and that's free. They do that as a public service.

Regarding a Junior College program for kids. I would like to see a syllabus, a lesson plan, including graphics, for that. I am an awful busy guy, and I would hate to sit down and create a Jr. College course on dowsing from scratch. I know I could do it. Maybe we should contact Donnie Schultz and see what David had come up with. He must have had lesson plans and graphics, and for the book that he wrote. I would really like to see an ASD Headquarters syllabus on how to teach at the Jr. College level, and include the graphics. I am willing to do a little bit of that.

[Joan C?]
I am willing to contact Donnie and work with her and doing the graphics, as I can do that.

JVD:
I would like to propose [writing out] what I do in an all day workshop, when I give it for 15 or 20 people. When I get through with them from 9:30 to 4:30, they are all good dowsers. [Yea. Clapping]

Ross Dedrickson, member Puget Sound Chapter.
My perceptions are that dowsing is often misunderstood. I make it a point to talk with the students at this college and they ask 'what's dowsing? [mimicking a teenagers skeptical, derogatory voice]. Perhaps the public perception of dowsing needs to amplified, added to, including the word divining, or what ever word you want to use. I like the word questing, a wonderful word the Canadians use. We have to have a balance between entertainment and education. If you entertain too much the people come and go. We need the education. There are many uses of dowsing. I went through many folders from conferences I could find, and I found 60 different uses for dowsing. I had an interesting experience two weeks ago. I went to a fairy congress in northern Washington, next to the Canadian boarder. There were 350 people. Children were costumed with wings etc. I volunteered to teach a dowsing class and we didn't have any tools, so I took branches off the bushed and the trees and used rocks and string for pendulum. And that's what made the people really connect with dowsing, you really didn't have to buy a lot of fancy tools. We got some very good interest from that. We found that parapsychology clubs and bookstores, the Art Bell chat club, and some of the libraries have some interest in that. I think publicity is very important. I am delighted to know that we will have a marketing director now.

Carolyn Stillman:
One of my concerns is the ban on medical treatment. I think if we could loosen that a little bit, we would appeal to a huge audience. People who are trying to do self help sort of things. And I understand this takes a change in By-laws and all that. I think we need to work at looking at enlarging our scope into the perception of dowsing as a bigger thing, rather than just looking for water. A lot of people just think of dowsing as water witching, and the don't realize the scope of how much you can use it, until you come to a conference like this. We don't advertise that and I think that is where we need to go. And a need to appeal to the younger people. If they can figure out how to get a job, how to dowse their compatibility with another person, where to live, schools [classes] to take, their doctors, their dentists, that sort of thing. When we talk about dowsing their professional people out of the phone book, we get lots of interest. That's the sort of stuff we need to put out there, in articles etc. (clapping)

Brian Dusbury (sp?):
One of the things we need in Tucson is teachers. We know where to get speakers and we have enough speakers. What we desperately need is people to teach dowsing. How are we going to get to the younger people and that can only come from experienced dowers, not a fund manager. Let's not confuse the two issues. If your trying to teach people you need teachers. We might need to train people to teach children. That seems to be an issue.

Feather Anderson:
That could be a course in the dowsing school, so every conference could have a teachers training. [comparison of dowsing tools, teach to teach]

Sue Trumpfheller - Trustee 91-93
I was on the fund raising committee and did a 'few other things'. I want to do some recall here. At the time Mike Doney was doing cub scouts, boy scouts through the schools, and I recall that he had written a program for a course outline for teaching children. Anybody recall that outline. Does Mike have something written up. Brian, a class to teach teachers was my idea too as I was coming up here. But I don't qualify, because I have never taken an ASD class on how to dowse. I came to this Society as a 20 year dowser and never knew it existed. I learned to dowse out of a magazine. In 1963, with small children in south Texas. I traveled all over the country and never met a dowser. So I read a book, 'Born To Heal', and in the back of the book was a resource, The American Society of Dowsers, there was also a reference to ARE. Within two months I was at an ARE symposium and a month later at my first dowsers meeting. How was I to find it. I knew how to dowse, but I didn't know there was anybody else out there.

PB:
What are we going to do with the information we have gleaned today? Once it has been taped, I am willing to transcribe it, in highlight form, but where are we going to distribute it, so more than the people who are here today, have a clue as to what was going on at this meeting and can participate.

[? Quarterly?] The quarterly is going to take 10 pages worth of notes from this meeting?? What about eventually the web site. I don't know if we can do it now. I'd love to do it now.

? Regardless of how you get it out to the membership, be sure you have the chapters have it.

OK, chapter heads get copies of what we have been talking about tonight. Then they can have a discussion in their own chapters.

? After this thing has gone out, they would be able to look at it, put in their own two cents worth, and add to it and that's how you will get some good ideas. Feed back through the chapter to the Regional Directors and the [ASD] President.

End of tape and meeting.

Robert Gandrup - Moderator (RG)
Barry Smith - President (BS)
Alex Champion: (AC)
Shirley Runco: (SR)
John Van Drie: (JVD)
Frank Jordan - Chairman of Marketing Committee (FJ)
Bruiena Skudenis (sp?):
Barry Langer: - Treasurer (BL)
Betty Epstein: (BE)
Shirley Runco (SR)
Gladys McCoy: 
Joan Champion: (JC)
Penelope Bell, Trustee: (PB)
Ralph Squire: (RS) 

Joe Smith
Taffy Lancer - Phoenix chapter
Dennis Swayda
Pohara Hart:
Don Harmon: 
Mardi Geissler: 
Ed Stillman, President Verde Valley chapter in Arizona, and ASD education advisor
Ross Dedrickson, member Puget Sound Chapter
Carolyn Stillman
Brian Dusbury (sp?):
Feather Anderson
Sue Trumpfheller Trustee 91-93

Contact information for some of the speakers, may be found in the program for the conference.